tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post9068602638456818965..comments2024-03-28T03:31:42.278-07:00Comments on Chiron: Heart and EgoRoryhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08483616030072739190noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-48603625094726212702016-08-30T00:58:42.487-07:002016-08-30T00:58:42.487-07:00Thank you, Mr. Miller! Your posts are like taking ...Thank you, Mr. Miller! Your posts are like taking Morpheus' red pill in "The Matrix." We need a clear mind to deal with reality.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-44886914927111520752016-07-29T15:24:29.288-07:002016-07-29T15:24:29.288-07:00Rory,
It's not an either or proposition, and ...Rory,<br /><br />It's not an either or proposition, and I think the problems start when we treat life as if it is. That we must choose once and love with the consequeses ever after.<br /><br />Our percetion of reality is not reality.<br /><br />This why one of my life principles that I try to live my life by is "Results Matter," because ultimately how we check to see if our percetion is correct is in how well we can use it to predictive it is.Josh Kruschkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09288700371539530398noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-13878459507387372502016-07-03T07:26:18.988-07:002016-07-03T07:26:18.988-07:00Thanks Rory!Thanks Rory!George Stokoehttps://www.facebook.com/george.stokoe.3noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-41105503112260210732016-07-03T00:20:46.940-07:002016-07-03T00:20:46.940-07:00George, the only comments I delete are the really ...George, the only comments I delete are the really crash commercial ones. The is fine. And a nice article. Politically, my main concern is that too many people think the government exists to solve problems and the creeping tendency to believe that includes all problems. It is a belief in direct opposition to classical liberalism (or, really any definition of liberalism).Roryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08483616030072739190noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-67109450614735600042016-07-02T17:22:07.867-07:002016-07-02T17:22:07.867-07:00Is it ok to post links in the comments Rory? (Plea...Is it ok to post links in the comments Rory? (Please delete if not.) This movie review/article seems relevant to your blog, above.<br />https://philosophynow.org/issues/114/The_Last_Supper<br /> " The Iowa housemates are not liberals, because they do not champion the liberal principle of tolerance, which is content-neutral, but only champion those viewpoints in which the content is broadly liberal/tolerant." <br />The implication of this article is, it's not about someone's specific social or political views. Social justice activists and conservative social thinkers for example love to bash each other for the other's lack of tolerance. (Especially on social media like Twitter, it seems everyone wants to get their retaliation in first.) But the article implies it's possible to be a bona fide right wing, or left wing, (or even, a traditional, middle-of-the-road) liberal.George Stokoehttps://www.facebook.com/george.stokoe.3noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-19222687375214353802016-05-29T15:48:33.693-07:002016-05-29T15:48:33.693-07:00I think you alluded to a workable version of the d...I think you alluded to a workable version of the duality asserted in the citation in your first paragraph: ego and heart are referring to ways of seeing, or to taking different perspectives.<br /><br />Or lenses. ("... safe to say you're addressing reality *through*...", emphasis added.) <br /><br />Ego lens concerns self importance and personal power to effect one's safety, comfort, avoidance of danger and of change.<br /><br />Heart lens is of unity, togetherness, likeness, collectivity, commonality, humility; also service and contribution to the whole. <br /><br />Ego here does not seem meant to refer to having a sense of individuality. Like "love", we use ego to mean significantly different things... <br /><br />These lenses (or perspectives; or states; or modes) are not strictly cognitive versus emotional etc., but have cognitive, emotional and behavioural dimensions.Ben Howdenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17251359584553427064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-53856496747492892032016-05-29T15:48:07.873-07:002016-05-29T15:48:07.873-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ben Howdenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17251359584553427064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-11783735986985761412016-05-29T15:44:44.926-07:002016-05-29T15:44:44.926-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ben Howdenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17251359584553427064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-43277256238872067992016-05-27T09:45:50.489-07:002016-05-27T09:45:50.489-07:00I nave always found it interesting how repelled pe...I nave always found it interesting how repelled people are by people who can behave without significant emotional attachment. Labelling them inhuman... despite acting from a human brain operation.. yet so many of our... human.... behaviours are those that are found in our and come from our primate and older animal ancestors...<br />Also given that we can't make decisions without some form of emotional involvement.. we are in some ways cursed and will be stuck with degrees of pro and con...The European Historical Combat Guildhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02425115205496881300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-19622511603814992042016-05-26T23:04:21.951-07:002016-05-26T23:04:21.951-07:00There are so many cognitive biases that I'm pr...There are so many cognitive biases that I'm pretty convinced humans almost never act based on reason. But then that's what makes us who we are. Why try to be something we're not?Neil Bednarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10310729903775947587noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-8886527083560205242016-05-26T17:51:20.945-07:002016-05-26T17:51:20.945-07:00Too long for here, but it seems that saying 't...Too long for here, but it seems that saying 'this dichotomy is false' is somewhat meaningless. Labeling to justify behavior (heart good, ego bad) is a different argument, surely, than working from your assertion that decisions based on feelings are not to be trusted, and because both are not to be trusted they are in fact the same thing? <br /><br />Ego (about self, and based on feelings regarding same in a social context - my definition), and Heart (about [perceived] connection to context and not necessarily about social standing - my definition) may not yield the same response to a situation. Are both based on feelings? Maybe .. Are both good places to make decisions from? Maybe/maybe not.<br /><br />Your example of the surgeon working on their own children implies they might be at risk of making a wrong judgement due to their connection and feeling for them ... but just as easily may not make a wrong judgement at all, perhaps even making a better decision due the connection and 'feeling' they feel. They might even do a better job if driven by their ego (I can't have people say I let my kid die).<br />Maybe ..<br /><br />So, I agree with the rationalization that using language after the fact can justify behavior we can live with by calling it 'heart', but the false dichotomy that you are trying to prove ... no, can't see it.<br /><br />Maybe a better start place in my mind would be 'was the decision a good one? How would I make a better one'?<br /><br />Sorry, messy. Better in conversation ...Maijahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18264657619197571965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-6455061537607235932016-05-26T15:45:03.701-07:002016-05-26T15:45:03.701-07:00Likely starting in the wrong place, Maija.
The poi...Likely starting in the wrong place, Maija.<br />The point I was _trying_ to make was 1) that the ego/heart dichotomy was false, There is also reason and now gut, but also consensus and computer modeling and probably a hundred other ways to create philosophies of life.<br />and, 2) People using any of the paradigms have hurt others needlessly, <br /><br />Roryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08483616030072739190noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-27824074830928810072016-05-26T15:40:30.008-07:002016-05-26T15:40:30.008-07:00Maija, I think "gut" is that ability to ...Maija, I think "gut" is that ability to assess a situation or person and make a judgement below the level of conscious thought. It might be based on facts or emotions (emotions are a fact, after all, even if they are not based on facts). It might be echoes of past similar situations. In my life it is most often in opposition to what I think I should decide, and so I pay close attention to it. <br /><br />Rory talks about how good we each are at reading other people-we can tell when the driver ahead of us is going to change lanes without signaling, we can tell when the person walking toward us on the sidewalk will swerve or walk into us. Sometimes it's called intuition. Kai Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13319136737099550784noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-46091093991412300322016-05-26T15:19:14.638-07:002016-05-26T15:19:14.638-07:00Oh, this talk will be a good one .. ;-)
Until the...Oh, this talk will be a good one .. ;-)<br /><br />Until then, where does the 'gut' sit all this? 'My gut says ..' Would that be feelings, or unarticulated reason?<br /><br />And I think you are starting the discussion from the wrong place.Maijahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18264657619197571965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-77895027044622751432016-05-26T12:06:01.989-07:002016-05-26T12:06:01.989-07:00Feelings don't compel action. They are just da...Feelings don't compel action. They are just data, and they are not always based on facts. (We can talk ourselves into believing anything is true because it feels right; that doesn't make it true.) Reason is the useful tool for decisionmaking. <br /><br />But feelings are not in opposition to ego. Ego is built on feelings-I feel important, I feel ignored, these are both ego positions that externalize emotions. <br /><br />Ugh, I want to express more here but the cognitive deficit is impeding me. Kai Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13319136737099550784noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-10681334554291693322016-05-26T08:37:09.220-07:002016-05-26T08:37:09.220-07:00Fiction example: This reminds me of something writ...Fiction example: This reminds me of something written about a villain in one of Terry Pratchett's books (Small Gods); "...mind as a steel ball - nothing went in, and nothing came out".Danpthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03984639599069766065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14473417.post-6212369287668189912016-05-25T13:18:55.752-07:002016-05-25T13:18:55.752-07:00Some complementary thoughts: 1. Chapter 14 of &q...Some complementary thoughts: 1. Chapter 14 of "Co-Dependent No More" by Meloday Beattie is on Feelings. Have the feeling, identify it, accept it, deal with it by examining the thoughts that go with it. Then apply your moral code and decide "what, if anything, we want to do about the feeling and the accompanying thought." Whole book is worth reading.<br /><br />2. For more on the effects of Communism: "Confucius Never Said" by Helen Raleigh, which is a first hand account of the Cultural Revolution in China and how 60 million people died (mostly from starvation) from 1959-1961. You can look it up.Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16639369830460933196noreply@blogger.com